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Liars !

(56 posts)
  1. shimatoree
    Member

    Islam has one fundamental principle to guide it's followers and that is Be Honest.
    However Muslims across the world probably the most
    dishonest group of people.
    Oh ! this is not an opinion or an attempted diatribe to generate debate- it is a fact.
    Should we take the example of Pakistan to start with.

    Since Pakistan is a rural society-( mostly) –let us examine a little bit of the village life.
    I am from the Frontier-( now called Pukhtunkhawah) so I shall restrict my comments to my own region.
    1. A person commits a murder. The killer is not known yet. When they go to the police station, most will give false testimony against the people they do not like even though they know that the person they are accusing is not the killer.
    2. A person takes over someone else’s land and occupies it and refuses to leave. The case goes to court and a decision is given against the culprit. The culprit continues to occupy the land and drags the case in the court system just to cause pain and stress(on purpose) to the legitimate owner.
    3. A man divorces his wife but refuses to pay her financial support as prescribed by Islamic law.
    4. A man dies. His sons refuse to give their fair share-( of land or money)- to their sisters even though prescribed by Islamic Law.
    5. Malicious, on purpose false testimony is the norm.
    6. Cheating in selling goods, selling foodstuffs at exorbitant prices during the month of Ramadan.
    7. Selling impure and known defective medications to sick people.
    8. Doctors operating even though the patient does not need an operation.
    9. Shopkeepers lying all the time about prices of goods they sell and saying that is good business.
    10. Everyone taking bribes by demanding bribes from anyone who needs anything, any document- even though they are getting paid a salary for their job.
    11. The mechanic lies about what needs to be done with someone’s machine
    12. The private schools are fleecing the WANA BEE parents without providing an education in return
    Suffice it to say that Muslims everywhere are liars, thieves and cheats.

    And there are a lot of people here who think they can compete with the decadent West in technology and scientific development. I wonder what they are SMOKING!
    Oh just think of the Saudis who have Sharia system of justice. Oh! They are so rotten that nothing needs be said about them. Same goes for the Gulf Sheikhs and the Nigerians( Champions in cheating and corruption).

    So all this hoopla about the Muslim Ummah- if only they were left alone by the oursiders- everything would be just great!
    Sorry no. Our history and even if we include the history of the Muslim Arabs and of Muslim Turks as our own-( which we do) exposes that rotten fact.
    When the 2005 earthquakes happened- the world gave a lot of money and material. What did we do ? Well some of us got very rich by selling those items.
    Oh not only the govt officlas but those that masqueraded as victims of the earthquake even though they were not.
    The ultimate example is that of Mullah Fazlu of the Diesel fame. And as yet everyone thinks he is a good politician and people still vote for this charlatan.

    There are not enough papers left for me write a list.
    Let me just say that salvation is not possible.
    I am ready and willing to face the artillery that I am sure will be fired in my direction.

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 16:06 #
  2. Dusky
    Member

    Bravo for coming up with such a factual charge sheet.

    And yet we chant the mantra “we are the best”

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 16:47 #
  3. My last experience; In a paper a female examiner expelled a female student from hall due to her bad attitude and non-sense in front of my eyes. Next day the girl claimed on Geo TV that she is innocent and examiner slapped her and expelled her out.

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 16:53 #
  4. @Shimatoree
    Should be no surprise to the man who quoted:

    "They (Muslims) pay the required BRIBES of prayer 5 times a day, Fast in Ramadan, sacrifice the animals on I'd, and perform Haj and after that they( Muslims) are free to do anything they wish. " end of quote.
    Morality and Ethics be damned."

    :-P

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 17:27 #
  5. Even if everything you say is true, shimatoree, forgive me, but I don't quite see the point you are making. Is it that the West is not decadent, is it that the Ummah is just a daydream and is not even worth thinking about? Is it... ach, but what need to go on and on. Just give us your conclusion: Should Muslims be urged to commit collective suicide? Actually, no need for that, it's more or less been done for them already by the West forces and their DU legacy and the phosphorus bomb, etc. So what next?

    And could we not find anything to say in favour of Muslims at all? At least their usual stoicism should find some favour in your eyes as it does in mine.

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 17:47 #
  6. achtung
    Member

    shimatoree bhai

    what ever you have written about we muslims (ummah) is 100% right. i have same feeling and some times in past i write here that we are nation of cheaters, liars, corrupts.

    question is why we can not come out of it?

    answers are 2.

    1) we are told by our mullas to hide our (muslims) mistakes unfairness and crimes and only express good deeds (ibaadat) done by us.
    2)as nota bhai said
    "They (Muslims) pay the required BRIBES of prayer 5 times a day, Fast in Ramadan, sacrifice the animals on I'd, and perform Haj and after that they( Muslims) are free to do anything they wish".

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 19:03 #
  7. Abdul Rahman
    Member

    We are certainly the nation of liars and cheaters. No doubt. But that does not mean anything. There is still hope.

    Allah says in the Quran: Never ever despair in the Mercy of Allah SBT.

    The Arabs were the worst on the planet and were lowest of the low and Islam tranformed them into the best of nations. It was a miracle that did it and insha'Allah it will be a miracle again. Prophet SAS said in his farewell address that he is living behind the Book-Quran and his example-Sunnah. If we adhere to that 100% and implement Shariah then it will be a miracle. Quran and Sunnah have been left with us until the end of the world to implement. We have turned our backs on it and unfortunately have embraced secular dajjali system in all our institutions-economic, social and political. Pleae note a new thread was recently opened here talking about a revolution. And that revolution should NOT be based on tribal, national or ethnic or economical domain like we had the communists or the French or the Iranian but a purely Islamic revolution devoid of geographical boundaries. When EU Kuffars are dismantling the man made boundaries and progressing towards common currency and common parliement, why are we sticking with colonial inspired boundaries? Why don't we follow Quran and Sunnah?

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 19:22 #
  8. Hussain Farooqui
    Member

    George Bernard Shaw had a debate with Mualana Abdul Aleem Siddiqui RA for three consecutive days. After the end of debate, Bernard said," I had a lot of mis-comprehensions about Islam before the debate, but now I realize that Islam is the best religion, but the Muslims are the worst nation because of being impractical". As a matter of fact, we had a downfall when we stopped maintaining our character in accordance with the teachings of our religion.

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 19:29 #
  9. shimatoree
    Member

    nota-

    Believe it or not you indirectly had something to do with me finally writing this. As you know I have been writing a few comments here - not very often but I have always read your comments. Unlike others your's are not your opinions but attempts at bringing forth facts and truths

    It is Ramadan and I do fast. In this month I try to speak the truth and after reading a a few comments, I decided to take the plunge . A friend of mine is visiting me and at Sehree we got to talking and the converstaion led to me writing about this.

    As I said, there is not enough paper in this world to put forth a list- but let me add a few more.

    1. The Wadera system of land grab.

    2. I have a relative who was a cabinet secretary in Islamabad in the late eighties and nineties and saw at first hand the big stealing and robbery of the nation being done by those very people who the nation trusted by electing them.( BB and Nawaz).

    3.I also know Farooq Adam who was the prosecutor general at NAB when Musharraf created the organization and thus have close knowledge of Musharraf's corruption along with a lot of others during that time.

    4. The dirt and the filth that we see in the streets -why is it there ? Oh it is there because we are a dirty and filthy people. Just go to Islamabad where POSH houses throw garbage just outside their homes.

    5. Do we teach our kids decency and honesty( at home) ?

    Mirza Sahib _

    As I said there is no salvation. Just imagine we lie to God 5 times a day. We say we are Muslims but we are anything but that.

    The suicide Bomber says he is sacrificing for Jihad but he is no different than the SHIA beating their chests in a procession a few times a year or the Mullah who calls the SHIA Kafir and spews venom against them.
    Both are brain washed by Mullahs who claim to be authorities of religion.

    We say we have built the JF-17. Have WE ?
    We are lying about that too. The frame is built by the Chinese and the engine by the Russians, avionic system by the Italians or French and the radar by someone else.

    How could we built those machines- it would require honesty and integrity which is very short supply.

    Oh! just do not go far- here at PKP- just read some of the comments. You will know.

    Everyone talks about revolution now a days. What revolution and by whom ?
    Revolution requires some degree of honesty and courage both of which are in short supply.

    If you still have doubts- here is few more.

    We treat 50 % of our population ( women) with pre-meditated contempt and derrisson. More than that we justify it on fabricated Islamic grounds. We forget that they are the FORMATIVE members of our families and society because they are the mothers of our children

    Musharraf did what he did in 2001 and a lot of people supported him and they still do even now after 10 years. Does that tell you something.

    The Prophet Mohammad declared DISHONESTY and LIES as mother of all evil.

    As yet we are champions in lying to tohers and to ourselves. Yes it is a bitter pill to swallow but it is true

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 19:47 #
  10. @HF
    The interview, if it indeed did happen, couldn't possibly have lasted three days as it is too brief (full 'transcript' here). And as to what Shaw said 'after the debate' is a fabrication I believe. I certainly think the author of this post gives it a fair treatment...

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 19:56 #
  11. Hussain Farooqui
    Member

    shimatoree

    There are Huqooq Ul Allah (Allah's rights) and Huquooq Ul Ibad (public rights). Huqooq Ul Ibad are more important than Huqooq Ul Allah, as Allah is Samad. The saints advised their disciples to not be negligent about Huqooq Ul Ibad by even 1%. Most of us, particularly, our Mullahs are deviating from the teachings of Islam in this respect.

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 19:57 #
  12. achtung
    Member

    hussain haqqani bhai

    "The saints advised their disciples to not be negligent about Huqooq Ul Ibad by even 1%. Most of us, particularly, our Mullahs are deviating from the teachings of Islam in this respect"

    this is where our downfall starts.

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 20:39 #
  13. Dusky
    Member

    @ Abdul Rahman: The Arabs were the worst on the planet and were lowest of the low and Islam tranformed them into the best of nations.

    Maybe this was true 1400 years ago, but in this age they are nowhere among the best of nations.

    Posted 1 year ago on 02 Sep 2010 20:41 #
  14. shimatoree
    Member

    AR-
    Your quote- "We are certainly the nation of liars and cheaters. No doubt. But that does not mean anything. "

    I disagree vehemently.

    After all The Prophet himself did say that lying and dishonesty are the mother of all evils.

    What more is needed to make the point.

    As far as there still being hope- well once again I do not think there is any hope at all.

    The lying and cheating has reached such a level that I feel that going back is not possible at all.

    The very fact that this thread has failed to create debate is an indication to me that no one wants to face upto the problems as they really are.

    The Shoe Fits.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 5:12 #
  15. @Shimatoree ,
    great thread .
    self analysis and self check is the thing ; which has been needed badly for the betterment of things .

    as they say :

    Become the Change , you want to see in the world .

    we all talk about change and revolution .
    but very few of us , think about self change and self revolution .
    we need a revolution in our behavior towards many things .
    otherwise ,we will go more down and down .

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 5:32 #
  16. shimatoree, you hit us over the head with the thickest stick you could find and then, while we lie there comatose, you up and complain no debate is possible with the likes of us. Somewhat unfair, don't you think?

    I'd much rather AR's "We are certainly the nation of liars and cheaters. No doubt. But that does not mean anything." A hint of the grandiose there.

    Shimatoree, reflect: you are supposed to be a fount of wisdom, not a fount of venom. Help us to get back onto our feet. Don't hit us over the head while we are prostrate, helpless and hopeless already.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 8:10 #
  17. rashidsaleem
    Member

    Rather than the list of “Do’s and Don’ts”, if we only start to think and act with rationality, a lot of things would change. Liberal thinking will answer most of our questions.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 9:51 #
  18. achtung
    Member

    mirza ghalib bhai

    "We are certainly the nation of liars and cheaters. No doubt. But that does not mean anything-- by abdul rehman bhai"

    if it sound you as our grandiose than hamara khuda hee hafiz hy. it also mean that we are happy to be liars and cheaters and continue to enjoy our life like that in future. it is not venom bhai jee. it is truth. only we our self can stand on our feet if we wish so and change us. we need hardest hitting on our head to bring us out from world of illusions.

    no offence intended mirza ghalib bhai

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 11:27 #
  19. shimatoree
    Member

    Mirza Sahib-

    First a correction-

    I did not say that no debate is POSSIBLE!

    What I did say is that when a difficult topic is put forth here-( by design by Me here) I have noticed that either the MODERATORS place it in the SIBERIA of Faith and Religion-( which they have created for the purpose) or the topic just is allowed to die due to neglect by commentators !

    Now to MEAT of the arguement-

    If you are going to try to treat a disease- first you have to accept that you DO have disease. Then examine it, the causes etc and how it came about.
    Only then you can think of treatments and like CANCER sometimes disease cannot be treated or like severe infections it is too late for ANTIBIOTICS to be of benefit.

    Now here in this case I would suggest the following-

    Each one of us must teach our children that dishonesty is UNACCEPTABLE.
    Then in our own conduct we should be totally uncompromising and refuse any form of dishonesty.
    That will mean that we will displease many-( as I and nota and others have discovered here at PKP)- and might be of damage to us in our financial or other interests.

    If we do that then at least we are starting a 1000 mile journey with one step.

    In addition, we should call a spade a spade. Lots of people have adopted the WESTERN way of being polite and non-confrontational and rather telling it like it is- they use modified deformed language to hide what the truth is.

    A revolution cannot correct anything if carried out by dishonest and corrupt people.
    We do not have any honest leaders on the horizon. They all want to do MUFAHEMAT and siasat of compromise and collusion.

    Once again I shall go to what the Prophet said- Dishonesty is the mother of all evils.

    And last but not the least- the religious establishment have to become the ETHICAL guards of the nation and speak like Jeremayah of the Old Testament of the Bible and take the risk of being burnt alive by the SINNERS like Giordano Bruno or being skinned alive like Mansoor Hussain Hallaj and Mazdak.

    Lastly- I like the language you have used to describe me. And I like it.
    If I have hit everyone over the head with a really big stick - Yes I have tried to do that on purpose-( in an intellectual sense) and I am very happy to do it. Why ?
    Because I love this nation of ours beyond anyone's imagination and this is the least I could do to help critical thinking .
    And you are not comatose. You have a lot of life left in you-( our nation) .

    Remember who my hero is ? Hazrat Umar. I am sure he would approve.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 11:56 #
  20. shimatoree
    Member

    Beenai-

    Thank you.

    And I might say that you have defined the problem and the solution very well indeed.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 11:57 #
  21. shimatoree
    Member

    To Everyone-

    I was expecting a barrage of ARTILLERY from everyone.

    Where is it ?
    When is it coming ?

    Or is the shock of the subject paralyzed everyone ?

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 11:59 #
  22. Shimatoree, I'm glad we got this far. Or as one says in common parlance: Now you're talking (buddy)!

    Everything you said above was perfect, not a word to be changed. What I object to occasionally is negativism on a grand scale which kills the morale needed for the least action. But you've set us back on track now.

    Yes: Honesty must be our first command. Both in speech and in action. Our religious leaders must learn to talk sense, face the music and, as you suggested, be willing to be burnt at the stake if need be. Our rulers must be held accountable for every action in our name they take.

    One thing more though, shimatoree: We must learn, the whole nation of Pakistan, that materialism is not the road to take. Our Prophet, the most honest of men, did not command us to be rich and comfortable. If anything, the contrary: God-fearing, honest and just and impervious to the deceits of this world (i.e. material goods, first and foremost, the attraction of which would compromise our integrity as Muslims). We didn't listen and voilà: Pakistan is a brilliant example of the results.

    Another thing, then, our maître à penser: the Pakistani diaspora the world over. Sure, remittances they send. Not to be sniffed at. They have helped our country out in more ways then one. But think of what Pakistan has lost: the brain drain, the ethical drain. What Pakistanis, with their sharp intelligence, learnt abroad was used for the benefit of the foreign countries. Pakistan did not at all benefit from their knowledge. I hold them equally responsible for the many tragic events that have overtaken us. And, specially, for our widespread "behesi" which is so constantly mentioned as a cause for our present decline. Not one of us beyond a certain age can claim we are not involved in the collective guilt of our nation towards its poor and downtrodden.

    I share your passion for Pakistan, shimatoree, just as I am full of appreciation for your critical thinking, backed by the courage to fling ugly truths in our faces and jerk us awake. Just so long as we agree that although many battles have already been lost, we are still in a position to win the overall war.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 12:48 #
  23. achtung, I just saw your comment above: No offence taken whatsoever. "Grandiose" did not refer to being happy the way we are and carrying merrily lying and cheating till death overtakes us. It was an allusion to the hope the words contained. Yes, we are the worst of the worst, but the possibility of improvement still exists. Without hope, we shan't be taking any steps forward.

    You defended shimatoree very well. Better than he did himself. Thanks for that.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 12:55 #
  24. Qalma'go
    Member

    Shimatoree has posted a nice well composed topic for discussion but a double faced hypocrite achtung through his comments is trying his best to hijack it towards Mullas bashing. Shame on you but you will never learn.
    MG failed to observe and realize this asteen ka sanp.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 13:34 #
  25. Good Lord! Is that true, achtung, Naseem? Or is this some residue from some past exchanges speaking? I quickly went up and had a look: We have ourselves to blame above all for what has been happening to us is an old achtung position. We have argued about that many times in the past already. Then he spoke of Haqooq-ul Ibad and there I wholly agree with him. True, his first posting was a bit anti-Mullah, but then the same remark could apply to shimatoree or nota's quoted words.

    Anyway, Naseem, we'll take your warning to heart, but how about you telling us now what you think of Shimatoree's charges against us Pakistanis. How right is he, where does he go wrong perhaps, that kind of thing. Thanks

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 13:57 #
  26. Qalma'go
    Member

    Shimatoree has very well laid out those social evils that are a product of a lack of real and thorough understanging of religion. Leading social evil is lying.

    Dung beetles like achtung swarm on such topics opened by Shimatoree that provide these 'na ghar ka na ghat ka' neo con pith0os plenty of opportunities to bash Islam ( through Mulla) and Pakistan with sly and cunning all the way pretending they are from among us and our well wishers when a much closer study of their comments will reveal well concealed venom. Mirza Ji yeh doghley hain. In say bach ker raho.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 14:14 #
  27. I agree most of the bloggers here. I would like to put a humble suggestions here. Despite all our sins and weaknesses we should not get disappointed from blessing of Allah. (LA TAQNATOO MINR REHMATULLAH.)

    One thing we can do first change our own person. We should become honest personally and then try to bring change in the society.

    Our Holy Prophet was born in a society which was worse than ours. In that society he was called Saidq and Ameen.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 14:18 #
  28. Thanks for advice, Naseem.

    Pakistani47 - That's it, that's right. You hit the nail on the head. Like our Prophet (PBUH) let us strive to be Sadiq and Ameen, each to the best of his or her ability. We'd change pretty fast then.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 14:41 #
  29. achtung
    Member

    naseem bhai

    "Dung beetles like achtung swarm on such topics opened by Shimatoree that provide these 'na ghar ka na ghat ka' neo con pith0os plenty of opportunities to bash Islam ( through Mulla) and Pakistan "

    1) thnx for your nice language
    2) you must know mulla is not islam or pakistan
    3) mullas tell people to pray namaz, keep roza, give zakat etc. you ever hear mulla telling people not to lie or be honest? therefore mullas, parents, teachers all are responsible for a society where we have liars, cheaters, dhokebaz etc.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 14:52 #
  30. @shimatoree

    I am ready and willing to face the artillery that I am sure will be fired in my direction.

    Spot on shimatoree. You have exposed quite a lot and NO, you will not face any artillery because each and every one of us has something to do directly or indirectly with what you have posted above.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 15:01 #
  31. shimatoree
    Member

    We cannot and SHOULD not blame the Mullah for our own ILLS.

    Though it is true that the ranks of the Mullahs have been invaded by the uncouth and crooks just like the leadership has been highjacked by thieves and crooks.

    Today one of the main reasons that we are still TRYING -( at least claiming to) to follow the Prophet(PBUH) is because in the last 1400 years after the death of the Prophet and Khulfa e Rashidoon- it HAS been the MULLAH who has continued and tried to remind us of our obligation to our religion- inspite of the Zaradris and Nawaz Shareefs and Musharrafs of those days. It is the Mullahs who saw us through the days of the Mongols.

    Yes these very same Mullahs that today we blame for everything.

    Even in this we are less than honest.
    We pay them little and we expect from them to provide modern education to our kids for FREE .
    We want them to MAKE our children Honest and ethical while we ourselves indulge in all kinds of obscenities and evils.

    It is easy to blame the Mullahs but KEEP IN MIND that in 2001 ONLY the mullahs stood up against the sell out to the West by Musharraf and the westernized Elite of Pakistan.

    Yes the Mullahs have been responsible for some of the social ills like the enslavement of women but they have done the societie's bidding at the societie's behest and taken the blame while the society escapes the blame.

    In case you have forgotten-

    Yazeed, Muawiyah , the whole Umayyad dynasty , the Abbassid dynasty and other kings etc were no less corrupt than the pesent day lot that we are stuck with.
    Do not forget the Uttoman Turk kings otherwise called Khalifas strangled their own sons, brothers and cousins on purpose so that they may become king.
    And yet we had people in Muslim India who started an entire movement for restoration of the same kind of people while at the same time ignoring the plight of the poor and of the downtrodden.
    And we have people here who continue to HARP on similar mantras.

    Let us reform our selves. Let us be honest both in our actions . If we do that we might not be rich or powerful but we will be OK in the eyes of God Almighty.

    And in the final analysis that is all that matters.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 15:07 #
  32. shimatoree, well done, well done. For your conclusion alone, a million bravos. We'll all leave this thread when the time comes, sadder, but wiser.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 16:10 #
  33. achtung
    Member

    shimatoree bhai

    plz allow me to say that there is difference between 'ulema' and 'mulla'. i am not saying any more as it is not topic of thread.

    yes i agree 100% that every one of us need to be honest and truthful otherwise we cannot claim to be muslims.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 16:56 #
  34. achtung, cheer up. I don't know what happened between you and Naseem in the past. Relations will mend over time, I don't doubt. Not to take his strong language to heart.

    And, perfectly right, the distinction you establish above between ulema and mulla. As for truth and honesty, henceforth, with Allah's help, we'll strive to achieve both and prove we are Muslims not just in name.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 17:28 #
  35. achtung
    Member

    thnx mirza ghalib bhai

    no problem with naseem bhai. wo jazbaati ho gaey hoo gey. i not mind. i hope me, you, shimatoree and many others will try there best to be honest and truthful. also we will convince our friends to be like this. i am sure if there is a 'tehreek' that we muslims become honest and truthful, a big positive change in our muslim society will come.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 17:43 #
  36. Inshallah, achtung, inshallah. Don't give up on Pakistan, is all I say. It's God's country. He'll give us the strength to improve.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 17:48 #
  37. achtung
    Member

    yes pakistan is country i love and live in. BTW when you will decide to settle in pakistan permanantly?

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 17:55 #
  38. Not exactly in my own hands, that, achtung. Allah will decide. But I shall certainly take the first plane out if a revolution were to break out anytime. There, nothing could hold me back, neither family nor friends. See you then, achtung. You'll be there, too, I bet.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 19:46 #
  39. achtung
    Member

    plz allow me to state urdu kahawat

    "na nou mann teil hoga, na radha nachay gi".
    no offence intended. just joking.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 20:35 #
  40. Perhaps you're right, who can say? The last Friday of this year's Ramzan and so much has happened already: Lahore and Quetta, for instance. No heart left even for a joke. God be with you, achtung, God be with you. And take extra care wherever you go.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 20:56 #
  41. Just to add a point to the charge sheet.

    Printing shops generates fake degrees almost daily. (my relative works in such computer printing shop and i have seen myself such 'customers'. Their documents get scanned, edited, printed)

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 22:34 #
  42. shimatoree
    Member

    Achtung-

    The only hope that Pakistan DOES have is that there ARE a -(quite a) few honest and decent people who do care.

    Posted 1 year ago on 03 Sep 2010 22:42 #
  43. Hussain Farooqui
    Member

    Our beloved Prophet said," The best person among you is the one whose moral character is the best". The problem of our society is that the people who lead our religious affairs are themselves morally bankrupted. They are:

    * Building mosques and maderesas on illegally occupied plots.
    * Receiving foreign and aid and hence working on
    foreign agendas.
    * Boosting sectarianism.
    * Running after their political and materialistic goals.

    Our society is thus in chaos. We need the type of religious leaders who preached Islam in this region with the demonstration of highest character and caliber.

    Posted 1 year ago on 04 Sep 2010 2:25 #
  44. shimatoree
    Member

    HF-

    And where are we going to get such religious leaders from? India or Arabia perhaps!

    Posted 1 year ago on 04 Sep 2010 23:28 #
  45. rehanahd
    Member

    Pakistan is a land of pure where everything is possible... We r liars, cheaters, thiefs, looters, sick and mentally slaved. Shim brother u r totally right.........

    Posted 1 year ago on 05 Sep 2010 0:46 #
  46. i used to blame America, Israel and Mulla for everything. Then I started reading Quran with Translation and its Tafseer..... Realized that we are only responsible for the high jacking of our religion by Mullas (Not Ulemma) Read Quran with Translation and Tafseer and you will slowly understand your religion and the hypocrites. I was surprised to read in Quran that there will be people who will pretend to be like us (muslims) and who will do everything like a muslim does.. they will read Quran and will understand it completely but will only tell/educate that part of ISlAM to the masses which will serve their evil purpose. I felt like a shiver through my spine...
    I did read some where else that only 1 out of 72 sect will go to Jannah and rest to hell... No need to find faults in others... Start self analysis first... Why do you support Zardari, Nawaz, Altaf, Asfandyaar, Maulana Diesel. Why do u vote a party whose ideology is based on ethnicity? Bacchay ko tou baad may sikhanna.. Pehlay khud say tou succh bolna seekho..... If we all cab ne honest to our own selves then this change will slowly engulf all of us.... Aysey hee "Revolution" nahee atta jannab!

    Posted 1 year ago on 05 Sep 2010 1:43 #
  47. Hussain Farooqui
    Member

    shimatoree

    There are good people also in our society, just that they are not apparent on the scenario. Good people of a corrupt society wait for appropriate time to do their action. When the common people get too tired of the corrupt environment of their society, then they start looking forward to good people a big change. That is the appropriate time for good people to come out and lead the masses. That was what happened in all the societies where revolutions took place.

    Posted 1 year ago on 05 Sep 2010 3:36 #
  48. shimatoree, you are getting feedback on your thread, then, and I'm so glad we've begun using our heads and hearts again. If I may make my last comment here on a religious note: Our Rasool Allah's beloved Ummah will survive this crisis as well. Pakistan's wake up call has come on a tremendous scale but, in Allah's infinite mercy, with a relatively low casualty rate. A lot of suffering, but surprisingly few deaths. Our next stop can only be that much longed for thing: Revolution and a better life for all. Believe in it, friends, believe in it. I've believed in it for decades now. And now the time is finally ripe, Inshallah. Let us not let the people of Pakistan down now at this fateful time.

    Posted 1 year ago on 05 Sep 2010 9:25 #
  49. shimatoree
    Member

    I will be the most SHOCKED person if REVOLUTION does come to Pakistan-

    the only revolution I see possible is a take over by the Taliban-like forces in a manner that took place in Russia in 1917.-( Bolshevik Revoltuion) and then begin the CATHARSIS of the society.

    Posted 1 year ago on 05 Sep 2010 12:02 #
  50. Bhai shimatoree,

    Revolution will come if we get united and work towards it. I may have gave up generally on lecturing people but I will continue to do my bits towards that goal, starting from self cleansing followed by family. Lead it by example in your house, family, muhalla, town, city and so forth. Join hands with people who are working for the flood victims. I can get you my contacts who after working in interior sindh are moving towards khyber Pukhtoonkhwa.

    @ MG: I am inshallah spending 27th Ramadan nite in harram shareef. Like everyone I will pray for pakistan before me or my family. On jummatul widda, I actually started praying for demise of these evil people who are raping this land but when I shared my frustration with my mother, she smiled and said that no one should give budduah to anyone in harram and it won't be accepted by ALLAH as it is ALLAH's house of peace & Salvation. So I may change my Dua tactics tonight and ask to destroy those who are against Islam and Pakistan. May ALLAH accept our fasts, Taraweeh, and all prayers/dua's.
    P.S: I am travelling back to mecca so don't think that Khan Sahib is on PKP from harram. LOL
    Just another 6 hours drive to mecca.
    BTW: any PKP member in Mecca tonight? Would love to meet someone from here. TC

    Posted 1 year ago on 05 Sep 2010 12:18 #

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